Okay Roo...it's time!

[PoxTheSmall]

To get a video card. I've spoken to a lot of people and they claim that the Geforce series is really good but that my card is just way to low...so here's the question for you (the expert):

If you had a choice of any Geforce card, which would you get (best bang for the buck)?

I plan to get one this weekend, hopefully less than $250 or so.

[Ivyrielle]

I would skip the Geforce cards and get an Nvidia Radeon 9800 or 9600 Pro card. 9800s were around 300 last I noticed (a few months ago), but you can get a 9600 128mb card for about 130-150, and a 9600 256mb for under $200. The difference between the 9800 and the 9600 will more than likely be imperceptible. (As in, looking for slightly smoother pixels around the edges of reflections in the water).

I've got the 9600 Pro 256mb card and lub it. :) My husband has the 9800 Pro 128mb card and is equally wild about it. Our bot puter as the 9600 128mb card, with no problems.

ATI updates their drivers monthly; fabulous cards for a really good price.

[PoxTheSmall]

http://shop1.outpost.com/product/3628345

Is this a good card?

[Boom]

Hmmmm, I'm considering a new card also. Not that I'm having particular problems, but I've had my geforce 4200 for a while now and I think much better cards are out now and stuff. I keep seeing numbers like 128 and 256 and I think my card is only 64.

So, lemme ask ya this way.

1. If money was no object which card would ya get.

2. If you had a $500 price cap which card would ya get.

3. If you had a $300 price cap which card would ya get.

4. Blah blah $200 blah blah.

5. Which of the above 4 answers is the best boom for the buck.

[PoxTheSmall]

/em puts on an "I'm with Stupid" t-shirt and sits next to Boooms.

What he said! :)

[Boom]

I want a shirt that says "I'm with Stupid" but with the arrow pointing down instead of sideways.

[Canidae]

Hey guys, I am sure Roo will answer your question later tonight. He is busy at work today and then as soon as he gets home we have to scat. :-) Just letting ya'll know why he hasn't answered.

[Figtoria]

Hmmmm, I'm considering a new card also. Not that I'm having particular problems, but I've had my geforce 4200 for a while now and I think much better cards are out now and stuff. I keep seeing numbers like 128 and 256 and I think my card is only 64.

So, lemme ask ya this way.

1. If money was no object which card would ya get..

ATI TECHNOLOGIES - ATI RADEON 9800 XT

2. If you had a $500 price cap which card would ya get.

ATI TECHNOLOGIES - ATI RADEON 9800 XT

3. If you had a $300 price cap which card would ya get..

ATI TECHNOLOGIES - ATI RADEON 9800 PRO

4. Blah blah $200 blah blah..

Wouldn't bother buying anything for less than $200.


5. Which of the above 4 answers is the best boom for the buck.


Today?


ATI TECHNOLOGIES - ATI RADEON 9800 PRO

[BugThuggin]

when you decide on the card, might wanna check out newegg.com, they have really good prices

[PoxTheSmall]

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=14-102-286&depa=0&section=2

9800 Pro - Total + tax from Pricewatch is $226 with 3 day ground shipping. That's not bad...

[UglyWolf]

O.K.... No nVidia love here so I'm going to speak up!!! I have had both ATI and nVidia cards in the past and all I would like to say is DRIVER SUPPORT!!!

I just built the following (Figgy's going to hate this one because it includes AMD):

Athlon 64 Bit 3200+
GigaByte nForce3 MoBo
2 - 10K RPM Raptor Serial ATA HDD's [RAID 0]
1GB Mushkin DDR433 Level II (2.2.2) RAM
GeForce FX 5900 Ultra Video
Creative Audigy2 ZS Sound Card
Venus 12 Copper Heat Sink
ThermalTake Xaser Case

All I can say is this system rocks; especially in the I/O & Video performance department!!!

I am aware that ATI is getting better with their driver support issues but they are still not to the level of nVidia IMHO. nVidia and AMD have always catered to hard core gamers and their latest products are no different.

Best advice, do pleanty of research and keep your mind open.

Talking systems is no different then talking politics or religion so let the flames begin... :flame:

:hump: :eh: :hump:

[Hammer]

I was gonna ask if ATI finally produced acceptable drivers? It wasn't even a question when I bought my TI4600. Nvidia was the fastest and really only stable card out there. So has Nvidia gotten lazy?

[UglyWolf]

I was gonna ask if ATI finally produced acceptable drivers? It wasn't even a question when I bought my TI4600. Nvidia was the fastest and really only stable card out there. So has Nvidia gotten lazy?

IMHO the 9800 series cards are very nice cards, the thing that turned me off was when they were exposed for writing their drivers around key benchmarks (i.e. MadOnion 3DMark) to try and win the gaming community over while ignoring real world usage.

No, nVidia still continues to update their drivers on almost a weekly basis and they perform very well. nVidia was also one of the first to release native 64 bit drivers for Windows XP 64 Bit Edition which I will be testing. This is why I'm pro nVidia I guess.

Again, I'm in the minority here. :ooer:

[Noleader]

Bottom line is most companies are still designing games around the Geforce chipset and drivers. They produce great cards and drivers and at the same time keep prices lower then ATI.

Bast bang for your buck has always been and remains Geforce cards.

One other point to bring up is all these people go get the best card on the shelf and put it in a so/so computer. All you do is slow your card down do to other system bottle necks.

When you buy the card Pox keep in mind what system you are putting it into and if you are going to be building a new system before you buy a new graphics card. If you are not I would get a card that is just outside the bubble when it comes to cutting edge.

Like Wolf said we all have our own spin on it but lastnight in RvR (60+ ppl at amg) I did not miss one frame or lag for one sec and I am running a Geforce along with nForce MB chipset :)

[spyder913]

another vote for the 9800 pro here

i love my 9700 pro

[Boom]

Sigh.

I knew yall would confuse me.

I'm just gonna get an ipod in a pretty color.

[Ivyrielle]

Get an ATI 9800 Pro, Boooms. I promise, you'll like it as much as my lil druid Shilah likes your shrooms! :D

[Rooster]

9800 Pro.. should be around $210 for an OEM.

I have it and LOVE it.

Except for BF:V right now (waiting on a fix for sound/graphics, something)... it's awesome.

[Rooster]

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=14-102-268&depa=0

[Rooster]

IMHO the 9800 series cards are very nice cards, the thing that turned me off was when they were exposed for writing their drivers around key benchmarks (i.e. MadOnion 3DMark) to try and win the gaming community over while ignoring real world usage.

No, nVidia still continues to update their drivers on almost a weekly basis and they perform very well. nVidia was also one of the first to release native 64 bit drivers for Windows XP 64 Bit Edition which I will be testing. This is why I'm pro nVidia I guess.

Again, I'm in the minority here. :ooer:
Actually Wolf, nVidia did it. ATI did it for Quake3.

[Rooster]

Bottom line is most companies are still designing games around the Geforce chipset and drivers. They produce great cards and drivers and at the same time keep prices lower then ATI.

Bast bang for your buck has always been and remains Geforce cards.
Not true.

their FX line is crap. Pure crap.

I wish it weren't. Overpriced POS's.

Go check out Half-Life 2 if you think it's made for nVidia. nVidia just pays bucks to get that on the boxes (like BF:V and other UT2004).

[UglyWolf]

Not true.

their FX line is crap. Pure crap.

I wish it weren't. Overpriced POS's.

Go check out Half-Life 2 if you think it's made for nVidia. nVidia just pays bucks to get that on the boxes (like BF:V and other UT2004).

"Crap. Pure crap." sounds like they are completely unusable, a bit extreme IMO.

This is what I ment...I completely disagree but whatever, that's why I recommend to folks that they do some research and get comfortable.

Just my 2 copper... ;)

[Figtoria]

Not true.

their FX line is crap. Pure crap.

I wish it weren't. Overpriced POS's.


Well, the world must be ending cuz I agree with Roo.


Bottom line for me - seeing hundreds of video card repairs every year is that ATI cards are better built and more reliable than any of the Geforce crap that's out there. We sell more of them and see fewer back for repair than any the Geforce line.

Hammer - yeah - that 3D mark thing sucked, but I noticed a point/counter-point thing that came out about the same time as that and apparently Nvidia does the same thing.

And yes, ATI has been bad with driver support for older systems and hardward. I have a USB TV-Wonder that I have to spoon-feed the driver set up to get it to work on WinXP (it's not supposed to at all - but I did make it work).

However, if you have new hardware and download the most recent driver for it from ATI's website - you will rarely have a problem.


However, I know that all you gamer-boy wots will buy AMD and NVidia and nothing I can say will make a difference. So have fun.

:)

[Rooster]

Uhh.. Figgy..

I have Intel and ATI... I buy what's best at the time. :p

[Rooster]

"Crap. Pure crap." sounds like they are completely unusable, a bit extreme IMO.

This is what I ment...I completely disagree but whatever, that's why I recommend to folks that they do some research and get comfortable.

Just my 2 copper... ;)Okay, I came off harsh. But it's intentional. nVidia is robbing their customers. The FX5200.. supposedely a DX9 part, but it's not fast enough to run any DX9 games. A GeForce3 is faster!

FX5600.. similar situation - but a GeForce4 is faster!

FX5900 & 5950. Over priced for their performance (although it is good performance!)

They've branded an entire line trying to entice people away from their current cards and it's a ripoff. There's NO innovation there at all. No improvements, just adding DX9 support. You can't even run DX9 games at a decent clip with anything but the 5900 series!

You say you should do your own research, but man.. I do this ALL day. It's practically my job. I custom build machines and I keep up with all the latest and greatest as well as canvassing the web for benchmarks.

Figgy here as a penchant for ATI & Intel - I don't really care who's name is on it. As long as it performs well for the money, I'm there.

Pentium 133 @ 150 w/S3 Virge
Pentium 133 @ 150 w/S3 Virge & Monster3D
Pentium 200MMX @ 266 w/TNT & Monster3D II (12MB!)
Celeron 400 @ 500 w/GeForce2, Voodoo3 3000
Pentium 3 650 @ 800 w/Voodoo3 3000, GeForce3
Athlon 1.2GHz @ 1.4 w/GeForce3, GeForce4 Ti4200
AMD XP2000+ @ 2200 w/GeForce4 Ti4200
AMD XP2200+ @ 2400 w/GeForce4 Ti4200
Pentium4 2.8C @ 3.06 w/GeForce4 Ti4200, ATI Radeon 9800 Pro 128MB

My next one will probably be a AMD64 4000+ or whatever it is then - unless Intel drops their BS Prescott line. That's a waste of money, as is their EE line.

I'm not a fanboy by any stretch of the imagination, but when I see a company that I've put some duckies in tries to dupe their customers (ala early Pentium4's & Celerons) - it pisses me off.

[spyder913]

I use ATI and AMD, but I used to use Intel and nVidia

Like roo I use what I think is best at the time

[Figtoria]

Uhh.. Figgy..

I have Intel and ATI... I buy what's best at the time. :p


Where did I say you didn't?



Neither AMD nor Nvidia have >ever< been what's "best at the time".


If that ever happens, I will be happy to use whatever is best.


Sheesh.

[Noleader]

Not true.

their FX line is crap. Pure crap.

I wish it weren't. Overpriced POS's.

Go check out Half-Life 2 if you think it's made for nVidia. nVidia just pays bucks to get that on the boxes (like BF:V and other UT2004).
This will all play out like Voodoo to Nvidia (When people called Nvidia crap too).

Like I said this is a dumb topic altogether because more peoples computers can not even reach total usage from the card.

In one breath you all complain about price then you say how nice Intel is. Want to talk about a rip go price Intel to AMD. Then research which chip offers more to the power user.

I say we all post benchmarks and see who does better :)

[UglyWolf]

I also do this daily but the thread was titled "Okay Roo...it's time!" so no sweat here, the 9800 is by no means bad advice. :cheese:

"Bottom line for me - seeing hundreds of video card repairs every year is that ATI cards are better built and more reliable than any of the Geforce crap that's out there."

- Careful, some manufacturers build both in the same facility (i.e. GigaByte, ASUS, etc.) using the various graphics engines.

Like I said, talking systems is like politics. To each, his own. :eh:

Best of luck with whatever you decide Pox!!!

[PoxTheSmall]

Okay, here's my deal...

I built my comp myself, and for a while, I was happy to a degree, although I had issues with bad ram and my comp kept crashing. I had originally gotten the ASUS P4b motherboard, which was the first pentium 4 board that allowed for PC133 memory which was crazy cheap, so I bought 3 512 sticks, one stick straight up didn't work, the other was somehow bad, because I blue screened all over in classic daoc.

I also had a Geforce 3 and 2 SCSI drives (IBM drives) I might add...one of which burned out within 4 months.

Anyhow, I eventually got TOA and realized by my huge lag and crashing all over, so I decided to get a new motherboard. I went out and picked one up, the Intel D875PBZ. I figured I could put my old P4 chip in and it'd work fine, but as it turned out, this card would only work with 533 / 800 mhz system bus processors and my old processor wouldn't work with it...so I had to go out and get a new processor.

Now, even after upgrading my comp several times, I still lag. I got a new stick of memory last month, so I'm up to 1 gig (corsair ram) and even got a new video card, a geforce 5200...which sucks such major ass that I can't have the video settings amped up without crashing constantly...

So I've narrowed my need down to the video card. I need to just spend a little money on a new card, and then maybe I can enjoy my system. It'd be really nice to play daoc with all effects on and have clipping at max and all the bells and whistles.

The question though is, will a Geforce give me a good bang for the buck? I mean, the 5900 series is crazy expensive and outside of my range, but the 9800 Pro is really affordible but is it stable...I mean really IS IT STABLE??? :)

[Rooster]

Stable?

Afaik, any video card is stable (nVidia or ATI).

If a game crashes because too many bells & whistles are turned on, it's not really the video card's fault.

But I play just about everything at 1600x1200 or 1280x1024/960 w/FSAA&AA.

[Figtoria]

In one breath you all complain about price then you say how nice Intel is. Want to talk about a rip go price Intel to AMD. Then research which chip offers more to the power user.

I say we all post benchmarks and see who does better :)


Benchmarks are a very wotty way of choosing equipment. Statistics can be made to say anything. Real life experience of hardware is more valuable to me. It's a very simple equation. We sell way more ATI than NVidia (and I'm including the Asus versions, etc.) and way fewer ATI come back with complaints or to be repaired.

When I had a TI4200 it crashed on me all the time in DAOC.

Haven't ever crashed with the 9500 Pro.


More expensive? Yup.
1/1000000 not as fast as Nvidia? Yup.
Worth it in terms of reliablity and lack of compatibility issues? Yup.

[Elvtin]

Forget all them!! Find a good ol' Voodoo 3 card!!
hehehe...

Heat can be an issue also for vid cards, so make sure you have good air flow threw yer case..

[Rooster]

Benchmarks are a very wotty way of choosing equipment. Statistics can be made to say anything. Real life experience of hardware is more valuable to me. It's a very simple equation. We sell way more ATI than NVidia (and I'm including the Asus versions, etc.) and way fewer ATI come back with complaints or to be repaired.

When I had a TI4200 it crashed on me all the time in DAOC.

Haven't ever crashed with the 9500 Pro.

More expensive? Yup.
1/1000000 not as fast as Nvidia? Yup.
Worth it in terms of reliablity and lack of compatibility issues? Yup.My Ti4200 ran great with DAoC. No problems at all! Must be your system. :p

Of course you sell more ATI, you're in Canada! But, ATI did recently pass nVidia in market share - and for good reason. ATI's 95/6 & 97/9800 series cards are superior to their competitor's.

Pre-9500, the GeForce4 Ti line was better, price/performance, drivers, reliability, etc...

And figgy, don't dis benchmarks if you're not willing to disclose the numbers of cards & ratios you sell/service. Your information is just as "questionable" as the benchmarks you're claiming to doubt. Don't get me wrong, I believe you believe in what you say, and I'm sure you're being truthful about it. But to say that your experience is the only truth in the matter (ie, others findings are questionable because they can't be trusted, or that they're methods are different than yours). That's why I use lots of sites as review sources. Some you have to take with a grain of salt, some you need to look at their slant (ie Tomshardware.com), but when they start agreeing, across the board (ala AMD64 cpu's dominating), you can start to see a trend, one that is near unrefutable unless one resorts to the "doubting-Thomas" mode.

[Rooster]

Forget all them!! Find a good ol' Voodoo 3 card!!
hehehe...

Heat can be an issue also for vid cards, so make sure you have good air flow threw yer case..I have one (or two!) if you want. :p

[Ivyrielle]

Hell, we've even got a Voodoo 5 in one of our spare parts boxes. Poor 3DFX. :(

(Another reason I opt for ATI over Nvidia. Not wild about a company using unfair competition (and frivilous lawsuits) to chase another company almost out of business, buy them, and discontinue all support for the product).

[PoxTheSmall]

If a game crashes because too many bells & whistles are turned on, it's not really the video card's fault.

But why wouldn't my comp crash when I have every setting on it's lowest for DAoC, and then the second I bump my settings to clipping=far and effects=all as well as including pre-cashing skins + reflective water do I then crash constantly?

[Rooster]

What card do you have?

I mean, if it's trying to do things it's not capable of... DAoC may get frustrated and quit out. If the video card locks up - you'll know it. You'll be stuck in game, with sound cycling normally... and have to reboot.

[Bearabald]

Best Buy near me had 9800Pro for $199 after a $50 mail-in rebate. My store was out of them pretty fast, but maybe you'll get lucky.

- Bear

[PoxTheSmall]

I have the Geforce 5200 card. That's exactly how I crash, Roo...I'd zone into a new area and immediately the music would be spooling but I'd be completely frozen.

The same happened with the Geforce 3.

[PoxTheSmall]

Yeah, generally speaking, I'll be able to get the 9800 Pro for around $199-$226. The one for $226 is after taxes and shipping, which is pretty sweet.

[Elvtin]

Hehehe.. Accually Roo... Sure!!! i need a lil pimp Machine to put like Win98 on so i can play my awesome Transport Tycoon game..
XP doesn't like it much and the compatablity mode doesn't werk..

[Rooster]

Btw Pox.. the ATI.. has a VPU recover. If it locks, it will reset the video card. :p

Talk about a nice feature. :) (haven't had case to use it yet though!)

Get the one at the link I posted from Newegg, OEM for $210-212.

You'll be happy.

[Rooster]

Hehehe.. Accually Roo... Sure!!! i need a lil pimp Machine to put like Win98 on so i can play my awesome Transport Tycoon game..
XP doesn't like it much and the compatablity mode doesn't werk..
You should try VMWare.. make a virtual Windows 98 machine. :)

[PoxTheSmall]

So Sapphire is a good manufacturer?

[Rooster]

I've been told they're actually doing the manufacturing of cards for ATI; ATI started just doing design & chips, instead of cards & chips.

That's the exact model I have. I love it. (Did I mention I really like my card?)

[Boom]

So should I get the pink imac or the baby blue one?

[PoxTheSmall]

I'd go with pink Booom, it seems ladies love pink!

Roo, I'll order it Friday then.

[Rooster]

Boom, green.

Pox, just do it before 12pm PST. :)

[PoxTheSmall]

Why before 12pm PST?

Heh, jeez...ironic how my county has one of the highest tax margins :(

[Rooster]

They'll likely ship it on friday if you order it before then. :)

[Elvtin]

i accually have Virtual PC

[Rooster]

That may work as well. Haven't used it though.

[Slightlyoff]

got a sapphire ATI Radeon 9800 pro from New Egg for around 260.00 for a retail box...good card but it might heat up your MB a bit ...if you have a program to check your MB temp and your CPU temp it might be an idea if you get this card to check it first time or two of playing DOAC..I put another fan in just to make sure nothing overheated..very good card though...just make sure to update your MB drivers first before installing Vid drivers then reinstall Directx again..I found out that if ya dont load them in order ..well lets just say ...the pute isnt happy and neither was I...until I did it right..that is

[Rooster]

You paid an extra $50, for what?

[PoxTheSmall]

So wait, I haven't gotten this card yet. Does it overheat? What should I do to keep it from running really hot?

[Rooster]

Eh? I thought you said you got it already, and that it was running hot. Oh, that's slightly.

I have no problems, and have not heard of others (except Slightly) that have heat issues.

Just make sure your case has adequate cooling (ie, push/pull airflow).

[Rooster]

got a sapphire ATI Radeon 9800 pro from New Egg for around 260.00 for a retail box...good card but it might heat up your MB a bit ...if you have a program to check your MB temp and your CPU temp it might be an idea if you get this card to check it first time or two of playing DOAC..I put another fan in just to make sure nothing overheated..very good card though...just make sure to update your MB drivers first before installing Vid drivers then reinstall Directx again..I found out that if ya dont load them in order ..well lets just say ...the pute isnt happy and neither was I...until I did it right..that is
A) I've not had any problems with my OEM overheating. I have 2 intake fans and 2 exhaust fans.

B) Loading DX9 again? I've not had to do that for ANY of my computers. Even going from GF4 to Radeon 9800 pro, never had to do that.

[PoxTheSmall]

I have 2 fans on either end, 2 pulling air in and 2 pushing air out the back. The dust on the wall can prove that they're functioning really well. :)

Slyt, could the heating issue be somehow related to the microwave that when turned on crashes your machine? :D

[cogsliastro]

check infotech.com they have a msi 5700 for like $150 its a good card and its 256:)

[IceFire]

I would skip the Geforce cards and get an Nvidia Radeon 9800 or 9600 Pro card. 9800s were around 300 last I noticed (a few months ago), but you can get a 9600 128mb card for about 130-150, and a 9600 256mb for under $200. The difference between the 9800 and the 9600 will more than likely be imperceptible. (As in, looking for slightly smoother pixels around the edges of reflections in the water).

I've got the 9600 Pro 256mb card and lub it. :) My husband has the 9800 Pro 128mb card and is equally wild about it. Our bot puter as the 9600 128mb card, with no problems.

ATI updates their drivers monthly; fabulous cards for a really good price.
Whats a: Nvidia Radeon 9800 or 9600 Pro card =)

About Hard Drives:
IBM drives = teh suck IMO... Dont ever by a IBM hard drive, When I was working at the University of Cincinnati as an Assistant network admin, 90% of the failed drives was IBM. We replaced I know 25-30 drives that year...I would go Western Digital or Maxtor....

[PoxTheSmall]

Yeah, I have a Maxtor now and I love it. It's the card that I'm all nervous about. I'll get it soon enough though.

[Ivyrielle]

[QUOTE=IceFire]Whats a: Nvidia Radeon 9800 or 9600 Pro card =)/quote]

Heh. Obviously I meant ATI Radeon 9600 Pro or 9800 Pro. I think I still haven't forgiven Nvidia over 3Dfx. /sniff

I'm a goober when i type, obviously!

[Rooster]

3dfx collapsed on themselves for their own reasons. :(

[Ivyrielle]

Not helped by Nvidia's nuisance lawsuits though. I knew people who lost jobs at 3dfx here in Dallas. :(

[Slightlyoff]

A) I've not had any problems with my OEM overheating. I have 2 intake fans and 2 exhaust fans.

B) Loading DX9 again? I've not had to do that for ANY of my computers. Even going from GF4 to Radeon 9800 pro, never had to do that.

1, I didnt say it overheated I said you need to make sure it doesnt ..my old mb was going tits up the new vid card just finished it off..I knew there was a problem previously..I didnt know what it was...now I do ..I put a new fan in when I put in the new mb to make sure I didnt shorten the life of my new stuff..

2, microsoft recommends reinstalling directx after loading vid drivers..but with the new mb drivers it went screwy..so I had to do a clean wipe because the Nvidia drivers previously installed along with the old mb drivers had left artifacts that messed with my new drivers..yada yada yada...its all better
Ive had to reinstall Directx everytime Ive updated my vid drivers or I start getting DDraw probs..if it hasnt happened to you so much the better

[Rooster]

Not just to me.. to ANY computer I upgrade.

[PoxTheSmall]

Okay, I just read a very interesting comparison between the FX 5900 XT and the 9800 XT. Needless to say the FX 5900 XT is $205 from Newegg.com (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=14-128-185&depa=0) and the 9800 Pro (not XT please note) is $211 from the same place (http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=14-102-268&depa=0)

Now Roo, between these 2, what's your feeling? The FX 5900 XT looks really really good but does it all boil down to drivers basically...as in whichever has the best driver support?

[Rooster]

5900XT isn't as good. The 5950 is. Look up the 5950 and you'll see the difference.

I LOVE how well the 9800 Pro handles FSAA & AA. I run UT2004 @ 1280x1024x32 with everything on highest (no need for FSAA) (& 3D + EAX Hardware sound) - and it runs awesome.

BF:V is running better now with the Omega (semi-ATI supported) drivers (and software sound -- sound is the real hog in BF:V).

[PoxTheSmall]

Ah, I just saw a head to head comparison between the 5900 XT and the 9600 Pro and the 5900 XT was just slightly better, so I'd guess the 9800 Pro blows the doors off the 5900 XT...

[Rooster]

Roger that.

[PoxTheSmall]

I just ordered the 9800 Pro (Sapphire) from newegg.com, 5 minutes ago. It should be arriving tomorrow!!! :)

[PoxTheSmall]

Okay, I love this card!

[Rooster]

Rock on! Told ya :)