Bill Clinton

[Morety]

I just saw him speaking here in Toronto at the Conference Centre.

I have to say I'm impressed with all he's doing these days. His speech was very inspiring.

His talking about creating a 21st Century that could be amazing, was...amazing.

I'd like to give him a big round of clap for all he's doing these days.

[Allison]

Yeah, say what you will, I always thought he had a good heart.

[MickeyFinn]

Good heart and educated, but still at the mercy of his constituants

[Golmacmourna]

*pinches bridge of nose*

...he... displayed... incredible... highly public... incompetence... and embarrassed the country... and let the elephants stampede into office... GWB is *his* fault.

*sigh* I mean. Yeah. Looking back... But come *on*. You shouldn't, standing the smoldering ashes of the apocalypse look back on the antichrist with fondness. (caution: hyperbole).

[Morety]

I'm not talking about his political past, I'm talking about his current efforts to make the world a better place in the 21st century. He was very on with a lot of what he said, and his efforts towards his goals are admirable.

[Post]

If the democrats sweep the branches in 2008 and royally screw up a bunch of things, I don't think I'll be putting any of the responsibility of that upon GWB. Nor will I be putting any of it on Clinton. Nor will I be putting it upon the person that got Clinton elected, and so on and so forth.

[Muadi]

Bill has always been a convincing speaker. Don't know what his ideas are, but, he is one of the slickest polititions around.

[Muadi]

I'd like to give him a big round of clap for all he's doing these days.

:rolly: Not sure how u ment this one, but I laughed. Knowing Bill, he has already been treated for the clap.

[Noleader]

:rolly: Not sure how u ment this one, but I laughed. Knowing Bill, he has already been treated for the clap.

HAHAHAHHA

[Noleader]

I'm not talking about his political past, I'm talking about his current efforts to make the world a better place in the 21st century. He was very on with a lot of what he said, and his efforts towards his goals are admirable.

I have been following his post presidental career and there is not a bad thing I can say about him (save supporting his Wife for President). If anything I think he has taken a good page from Carter on how to live after the Whitehouse.

[MickeyFinn]

I'd rather vote for Hillary than Kerry. Blech.

[Golmacmourna]

... so ... you prefer vampire movies to mummy movies?

[MickeyFinn]

Well, I *did* visit PennsylVAAAANNNIAAAA that one time

[gepper]

Bill Clinton is one of the best Politicians because he is more entertainer then politician. Second, I liked how he came out with that assistance for those with mines. He acted like he was doing it for them. He has a mine on his property that he and his wife own. Self interest. Canadians like him because he tried to leave Hillary for their younger version. Old Hillary took care of that. He also says he is interested in saving the planet. Well, he has his own self interest in China. He is heavily invested there and is part of the problem. I would say Hillary should do something about that, but, she is heavily invested in India, which is just as bad. So between the Clintons, and Bushs,you have a large portion of the labor lose to Americans and destruction of the ecosystem. GO AMERICA


PS Clinton accidently bombed Chinese Embassy trying to get those nasty terrorist. He gave them plans to make a really nice nuclear bomb you repayment. They ended up accidently giving him a ton of cash for his second term. Ooopps! Good thing he had Gore to blame that on. Good thing he was to focused on his great invention the Internet. Which he was an officer that was part of its creation.

[Golmacmourna]

Little known fact number 243: After the cigar was the saxophone.

[]LoL[Harm]

All I know is Clinton is in league with aliens, and those aliens are responsible for getting the different colors of toothpaste to align properly inside the toothpaste tube, without them getting all mixed up like you'd think they'd get.

[Allison]

I think he drowns puppies in his spare time, too.

[Figtoria]

I like Clinton. I even liked him back when he was getting blow jobs.

I like blow jobs. I just never saw why this was such a big deal.

He was stupid to lie about it, but married men tend to lie about stuff like that.

From what I've read about other past presidents, Clinton was in good company - he just had the misfortune to have his presidency during a time when the media treats presidents a lot less deferentially than in the past.

He certainly is at least 100 IQ points more intelligent than your current president.

[Noleader]

The blowjob was not the big issue Figgy. The issue was that he lied on the stand. I firmly beleive that no person is above the law in this nation and he should have been held accountable for perjury.

As for Mr. Bush, he should be arrested and changed with all the crimes he commited while in office.

[Popo]

I think he drowns puppies in his spare time, too.

You got it all wrong, he's 100% fueled by puppy. That's why he's so terrible.

[Golmacmourna]

The blowjob was not the big issue Figgy. The issue was that he lied on the stand. I firmly beleive that no person is above the law in this nation and he should have been held accountable for perjury.


That wasn't the issue either. The issue was that he was the *president* and he was getting taken down by a blow job. That's farcical and a display of unbelievable political incompetence and a failure of strategic thinking. If you can't get a blow job in secret, then what hope do we have that you can cope with the other problems? Furthermore, where's the self-restraint?

*MEANWHILE* the fucking *CLOWNSQUAD* manages to keep every goddamn email they write secret and weather legitimate accusations of treason and incompetence like it's *NOTHING*.

That's why Clinton is the devil. If you are competent, then *act* like it. Don't let the fuckheads stab you in the back and usher in an era of fuckheadery. People accuse clinton of going to war in bosnia in order to distract people--the fact of the matter is, if that's the case, he must have really screwed it up, because every other time someone does it, nobody even bothers mentioning that it's a distraction--or, at least, they're not taken seriously.

[Allison]

The blowjob was not the big issue Figgy. The issue was that he lied on the stand. I firmly beleive that no person is above the law in this nation and he should have been held accountable for perjury.



Just as a factual correction, he did lie, but the lie didn't amount to perjury. The lie has to be relevant to the case in order for it to rise to the level of perjury. For example, I could lie under oath about having a turkey sandwich for lunch (I actually had some steamed vegetables and a corn muffin), and it wouldn't be perjury unless what I had for lunch was relevant to the case. A judge ruled that his testimony about Monica Lewinsky wasn't relevant to the Paula Jones case, therefore, it wasn't perjury.

But he was held accountable for the lie, nonetheless. He was impeached on charges of perjury and obstruction of justice, but was acquitted. Maybe you meant to say that he should have been punished for the lie.

[Noleader]

I can only assume that the ruling came after he had already issued the testimony as had it come before he would not have had to testify. So if that is the case it would be more like if you lied about your lunch when for all you knew it could have been relevant to the case; just to get caught and later be forgiven because it turned out not to be relevant.

I have taken the oath a number of times and I remember it as clear as day: Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?

Some how in that oath I fail to see were it says "The truth only in places you think are relevant." Also even if it was not a factual violation of the law, which I still firmly think it was, he did indeed violate the spirit of the law.

[Golmacmourna]

I think he should have been punished for missing her mouth so badly.

[Allison]

All I'm saying is that lying under oath isn't necessarily perjury ... certain conditions must be met before lying rises to a criminal offense ... and that he was held accountable by Congress. If you aren't happy with the acquittal, that's one thing, but that doesn't mean there was no accountability.

[gepper]

I now understand why he is touring third world countries trying to help out! All those people missing their teeth must be like heaven to him

[Golmacmourna]

And they *need* that protein...

[Noleader]

I think he was held accountable. I was just clearing up the fact that people still focus on the blowjob and not the fact he lied.

[gepper]

Human emergency protein distribution system or better known as HEPDS must be Bills new organization. Though I notice him and Senior get along pretty well. They probably tag team one nation at a time.

[Golmacmourna]

oh man... so *that's* what the 1000 points of light means...

[gepper]

Ohh, forgot about the very valuable pearl necklaces also?

[Allison]

I think he was held accountable. I was just clearing up the fact that people still focus on the blowjob and not the fact he lied.

gotcha.

[Andolinni]

*pinches bridge of nose*

...he... displayed... incredible... highly public... incompetence... and embarrassed the country... and let the elephants stampede into office... GWB is *his* fault.

*sigh* I mean. Yeah. Looking back... But come *on*. You shouldn't, standing the smoldering ashes of the apocalypse look back on the antichrist with fondness. (caution: hyperbole).

yea obviously having an extra marital affair is a mistake that lead to war in the middle east and conflict abroad. U're crazy. how the hell can u bash clinton and gwb at the same time... u pesimist. isn't politic's all about blaming ur predesecor for all ur problems. they work like a see-saw. problem vs. blame. clinton vs bush. where have u been last .. 20 years of presidency.

All i know is that i can deal with another clinton. I know what to expect. If she fucks another woman, i can deal with this. And in case u didn't know, if u live in ark. then the word around town last 20 years is she swings that way. but hell lets get honest here. what do u want, something that u can anticipate and prepare collatoral damage in the terms of thousands of dollars in monetary funds... or the unanticipated attack on another country like iran that costs could lead to trillions of dollars and conflicts abroad while knowing that we're looking at a climate change that will change our lives completly in a short time. I'll take a clinton, a person that has been in american politics for what.. like 35 years plus over an unknown like obama. Al gore can stand on the sidelines all he wants, if he officially supports obama then that'd sway a huge margin of voters. but for now, all we know is our past. and past says that clinton administration had the pulitzer peace prize winner that is al gore in it's administration and who else could better lead america and the world through something as scary as polar ice caps melting.

I think obama has a GREAT voice. he brings to table a lot of great topics that need to be discussed. but just because he brings up the issue doesn't mean he has the right answer. he has the right topics, but i think that clinton is better suited to fit the bill.

[Andolinni]

If the democrats sweep the branches in 2008 and royally screw up a bunch of things, I don't think I'll be putting any of the responsibility of that upon GWB. Nor will I be putting any of it on Clinton. Nor will I be putting it upon the person that got Clinton elected, and so on and so forth.

so like... do u find that ghandi would be a great president? i got this great yoga video that will totally kick someone's ass through cival disobediance. i'm sure there is a website out there willing to pay for ur video's. search "fetish" and "moron"

:fuct: cause thats a :fuct: up post.

[Andolinni]

Bill Clinton is one of the best Politicians because he is more entertainer then politician. Second, I liked how he came out with that assistance for those with mines. He acted like he was doing it for them. He has a mine on his property that he and his wife own. Self interest. Canadians like him because he tried to leave Hillary for their younger version. Old Hillary took care of that. He also says he is interested in saving the planet. Well, he has his own self interest in China. He is heavily invested there and is part of the problem. I would say Hillary should do something about that, but, she is heavily invested in India, which is just as bad. So between the Clintons, and Bushs,you have a large portion of the labor lose to Americans and destruction of the ecosystem. GO AMERICA


PS Clinton accidently bombed Chinese Embassy trying to get those nasty terrorist. He gave them plans to make a really nice nuclear bomb you repayment. They ended up accidently giving him a ton of cash for his second term. Ooopps! Good thing he had Gore to blame that on. Good thing he was to focused on his great invention the Internet. Which he was an officer that was part of its creation.

kudos. i liked the claps joke from muadi also tho. u dirty girl, even myself in my infinant dirty garbage dispensor gutter of a mind was surprised. i liked ur arguement gepper

[Andolinni]

I like Clinton. I even liked him back when he was getting blow jobs.

I like blow jobs. I just never saw why this was such a big deal.

He was stupid to lie about it, but married men tend to lie about stuff like that.

From what I've read about other past presidents, Clinton was in good company - he just had the misfortune to have his presidency during a time when the media treats presidents a lot less deferentially than in the past.

He certainly is at least 100 IQ points more intelligent than your current president.

OMFG. BTW PEOPLE. IF U HAVE NOT GOTTEN SO DRUNK U'VE HIT ON SOMEONE AND SAID SOMETHING OR DONE SOMETHING U SHOULDN'T HAVE... U HAVN'T LIVED YET. get the freggin memo.

[Andolinni]

That wasn't the issue either. The issue was that he was the *president* and he was getting taken down by a blow job. That's farcical and a display of unbelievable political incompetence and a failure of strategic thinking. If you can't get a blow job in secret, then what hope do we have that you can cope with the other problems? Furthermore, where's the self-restraint?

*MEANWHILE* the fucking *CLOWNSQUAD* manages to keep every goddamn email they write secret and weather legitimate accusations of treason and incompetence like it's *NOTHING*.

That's why Clinton is the devil. If you are competent, then *act* like it. Don't let the fuckheads stab you in the back and usher in an era of fuckheadery. People accuse clinton of going to war in bosnia in order to distract people--the fact of the matter is, if that's the case, he must have really screwed it up, because every other time someone does it, nobody even bothers mentioning that it's a distraction--or, at least, they're not taken seriously.

i completly agre with ur first paragraph of comment. the rest... whao whao whao. u can't completly blame clinton for not washing her dress before she left... that'd be akward. no one fucks like that... maybe it was his first date. do u tell ur first date to go wash her clothes and take a shower before she leaves.... cause if u do, she should have turned u in by now. and in that case it's ur bad, and u fucked up. he offered a fun time: "fuck the leader of the free world and don't tell". i did it once too. but we digress.

get fucking real. jfk fucked hella bitches and EVERYONE LOVED HIM. the prick damn near had an orgy while getting sang to for his birthday... like wtf.. u people would flip nowdays over that. don't u realize the power of the president. and clinton didn't even force the power. that broad gave it up freely. look at bush, he's rewriting the constitution damn near with the powers of office and u pricks aint got nothing because u pushed over extra merital affairs. huge mistake in my opinion. people would care about the word impeachment if we hadn't made such a huge deal about a FUCKING BLOWJOB. get real people. get real. people have extra merital affairs everyday, sometimes it's just once and it's just a blowjob. not a reason to screw over the rest of the world history

lets think about this for a second. clinton could have bombed osama... he had the birds in the air with bombs, coords and absolute target. our media claimed he was "waggin the dog" and the fucker backed down to show that he wasn't wagging the dog. u fuckers and ur impeachment and worriness over nonissue's... u bring us down. ur stuck in 1930, come into the now. if those birds had gone live and hot and taken out that target... what would the world be like right now. i bet things would be better, gas prices lower and the globe gearing up for global warming and how to defeat it rather than terrorism and the fucking wag the dog that we created on ourselves. problem is that each gov is their own wag the dog now and we just do circles jacking each other off. gratz on this.



all i'm saying is to consider the facts. and not where ur heart resides. don't worry so much about the moral view as for wtf we ganna do to make ourselves better.

[Andolinni]

*pinches bridge of nose*

...he... displayed... incredible... highly public... incompetence... and embarrassed the country... and let the elephants stampede into office... GWB is *his* fault.

*sigh* I mean. Yeah. Looking back... But come *on*. You shouldn't, standing the smoldering ashes of the apocalypse look back on the antichrist with fondness. (caution: hyperbole).

HOLY ... are u out ur godgiven mind? let me ask what book u read that says that antichrist is a political figure. u could argue a champion of the people, but far as i understand antichrist comes through humble beginings. and as far as i'm concerned the mayan calander and the prophecy of nostrodamus make an accord to the next pope after this pope will be antichrist. i'm just wondering if u saying this for shock value or if it's an actual arguement. cause if u want shock value, lemme give u a hint: "sup bitch, wanna fuck" never works, but it's great shock value.

[MickeyFinn]

6 straight posts?

[Andolinni]

6 straight posts?

my bad damn, i shoulda been faster on the 7th in a row. why u have to cockblock me mickey?

[Boom]

I have taken the oath a number of times and I remember it as clear as day: Do you swear to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth?

Some how in that oath I fail to see were it says "The truth only in places you think are relevant." Also even if it was not a factual violation of the law, which I still firmly think it was, he did indeed violate the spirit of the law.

You are mixing up violating the oath and violating the law. They are two distinctly different things. He definitely violated the oath. There is no doubt about that. However, the oath itself is not a law. The law of perjury is that you can not violate the oath when the testimony has probative value regarding a cause of action in the instant suit. The law of perjury does not say "You can not lie under oath period." If that was the law, then yes, he would have violated it. But it is not the law.

Whether or not he had consentual relations with Monica has no bearing on whether he harrassed Paula. So therefore, he did violate the oath, but he did not violate the law of perjury, which is why he was acquitted.

I am not defending him or saying what he did is excusable, I am just clarifying the legal technicalities of this issue. Although the fact that Newt Gingrich was having and concealing an extramartial affair with an intern at the time he was railing and raving about Clinton from the podium of the Speaker of the House really gets my goat. I know, his lies weren't under oath, but there is still a level of hypocrisy there.

What Scooter Libby did was perjury. He lied under oath, and his lies were specifically and purposefully crafted to conceal his and boss's involvement in the exposure of the undercover (now verified, undercover) CIA agent responsible for investigating weapons of mass destruction in the middle east, putting all of her contacts and our nation's security at great risk. His lies under oath were directly related to the case at hand, and prevented the DOJ from fully investigating and prosecuting the outing of a CIA agent. That is why he was found guilty beyond a reasonable doubt and convicted of multiple counts of perjury and one count of obstructing justice. The fact that he was given a get out of jail free card and therefore was never forced to tell the truth is why Cheney was never charged with coordinating the outing of Plame. We all know Cheney was telling everyone in the Whitehouse to leak to the press in order to retaliate against Wilson for letting us know that Bush lied in his State of the Union address with the bogus nigerian uranium claim. We have Cheney's handwritten notes about Plame on the copy of the NYT with Wilson's article, but without Libby's testimony there isn't enough to bring him to trial. Also, the 5 million missing Whitehouse emails tended to set back the investigation as well.

Sorry, I'm still not over the Libby thing. I have no problem with presidental pardons in general, but if someone close to the president can lie under oath to cover up Whitehouse crimes and be pardoned, that pretty much gives the Whitehouse immunity from any attempt to hold it accountable for violations of the law.

[gepper]

The only thing about Libby is that he was pardoned during the administrations term. Most pardons like this that are politically motivated are at the very end of a Presidents term. I am not sure what the record is on this, but, Clinton also pardoned many people who were tied to him through politics or through fund raisers. What is worse, pardoning one of your guys, or taking financial backing, publicity, and gifts, or protecting one of your own? I wouldn't say that Clinton was the only one to do this by far. I have no idea as this of course was the last President and the only one I paid attention to because of my age. I just find it hard to put down him for pardoning someone like this for these reasoning when so many other pardons should be considered criminal.

As for what he supposedly did or didn't do? Which I am still not certain beyond obstructing justice what he did. I see how it can hurt how CIA agents currently, past or in the future are seen by outside countries, like they don't know we and they both use embassies as bases for intelligence. But, as for the wife that was supposedly outed, she is the same one that came out with a book and is doing the tours! I don't care about her as well as other governments don't care. Get over it.

[Muadi]

Boom.... I always like reading your comments... but damn, you make my head hurt. :)

[Post]

"What is worse, pardoning one of your guys, or taking financial backing, publicity, and gifts, or protecting one of your own?"

I'm not familiar with Clinton's pardon's specifics, so which ones are you talking about that equate to giving the White House immunity in a fashion that Libby's testimony did?

Edit: "But, as for the wife that was supposedly outed, she is the same one that came out with a book and is doing the tours!"

How is it fair to assume she wasn't happy doing her patriotic duty as her job? If I got in a car wreck that took me a year or two of therapy to fully recover, it wouldn't be worth the million dollars I received from the lawsuit. Despite it being worth it to a whole bunch of other people.

And not "supposedly" outed. "Really" outed.

[gepper]

It has been awhile, but, from what I remember Bills brother or step brother receive financial gain for helping a multimillionar get pardoned for tax evasion or something like that. There was a long list of people that Clinton pardoned when he left, many who were picked out as either helping Clinton gain one way or another or many other reasons. I am sure that there were equally long lists for presidents in the past that included being pardoned for gain. I am just saying that I don't feel upset for someone getting pardon who has been a loyalist versus someone who is pardoned for gain.
I can see someone being upset that he didn't even actually spend any time in jail. I believe that it would have gone over easier if he spent a week or a month in prison versus pardon before he even went so that he doesn't have the ability to say that he at least did the minimal or else people will go out and do it anyways.

[gepper]

Ohh, and I forgot, who did out her? From what I heard it wasn't Libby, but someone else? I thought he was going to prison for the coverup or obstruction of justice?

She might have been feeling bad at the time, but she didn't seem to be upset when she was doing the talk shows. As for her husband. He should have lost his job and had been replaced by someone else if Bush is in charge of that department. If you can't trust someone to be "your" diplomat, then wouldn't you let him go?

[Post]

Oh, I know that presidents (all of them as far as I know), end up pardoning people as personal favors (and that sucks). But I'm wondering if Clinton ever used his pardons to directly shield his administration from the long arm of the law. ie, the issue wasn't the pardon so much as what the pardon was protecting.

[Post]

"Ohh, and I forgot, who did out her? From what I heard it wasn't Libby, but someone else? I thought he was going to prison for the coverup or obstruction of justice?"

An outing of a CIA agent isn't only done by the first person who states it, it's anyone that purposefully and directly lends merit to the person being a CIA agent while it's still being held a secret by the CIA.

[Golmacmourna]

Oh good, we're back.

JFK was clearly killed by the CIA on the grassy Noel (not the first noel, but still a good one), as part of a yuletide plot, and Clinton was taken down by Monica who was, without question, a CIA agent trained in the arts of baby got back, so it seems pretty clear that outing Valerie Plame was a necessary act to protect this administration from the machinations of the black box (which is actually NSA headquarters, but whatever--all shady spy organizations look alike).

[Allison]

She might have been feeling bad at the time, but she didn't seem to be upset when she was doing the talk shows.

You must have had the sound turned down.

[Boom]

You must have had the sound turned down.
QFT. Seriously, you must have had the sound turned off completely. I think Plame's exact words were that she felt like she was punched in the gut. She was devistated. Her entire life she wanted to serve her country as a CIA agent and that was taken away from her. But I am not as concerned with her personal loss as much as the loss to our Country. Her unique skills, experience and training were taken away from all of us.

You don't see how outing Plame hurts our Country?

She was an active, high level, experienced, undercover CIA agent responsible for our program to learn about middle east WMDs. She worked overseas. She was/is incredibly knowledgeable about the Middle East. She was a great asset to our intelligence efforts. She is no longer an asset to the CIA. That hurts our Country and our security.

Her cover was blown. Her cover was that she worked for a pretend company. Other CIA agents use covers that involve this same cover/pretend company. When she was outted, they may have been outted. They may no longer be assets to the CIA and if they were overseas at the time, their lives could have been at risk.

There is a reason why outting a CIA agent is considered treason. It is a huge blow to our security. Do you know how much money it costs to train someone like Plame? That money is in the toilet. You really think its no big deal that she was outted? Do you think she can be easily replaced?

So the leak was a clearly a bad thing. Now on to the pardon.

Clinton did not pardon anyone to protect the criminal behavior of his own administration. I think that there is a huge huge huge difference between pardoning a friend or supporter and pardoning someone for lying to cover up the crimes of your own administration. Clinton's pardon's may have been questionable, but they weren't a tool to protect his Admin from a DOJ investigation.

Clinton's pardons allowed him to make his friends happy.

Bush's pardon allowed his adminstration to get away with leaking the identity of an undercover CIA agent.

You see the difference?

On to Libby's role...

Libby was a confirming source of Plame's identity, as was Rove. The original source was Armitage.

Libby's crime was lying repeatedly under oath to obstruct justice in the investigation of the coordinated effort (led by Cheney) to out an undercover CIA agent in retaliation for her husband writing a NY Times article which revealed that Bush lied to America about Saddam's WMDs in order to bring us to a war that his PNAC buddies had been pushing for since the mid 90s. You know about PNAC right? Cheney, Rumsfeld, Libby, and about 15 other members of the Bush Admin are signatory members of this pro-war group. I've linked the documents here a few times.

This isn't a grassy knoll theory, this is all documented, proven in a court of law beyond a reasonable doubt.

It's simple, think about the following undeniable, facts.

1. The Bush Admin leaked the identity of an undercover CIA agent.
2. The DOJ was unable to prosecute anyone for coordinating this effort.

Isn't that strange? The Bush Admin has now admitted that the Whitehouse was the source (and confirming source and other confirming source, etc. etc.) of Plame's identity. They were leaking all over the place to anyone who would listen. It is a crime to leak an undercover CIA agent's identity.

But no one has been charged for this crime. Now that is the $50,000 dollar question.

Why has no one been charged for coordinating this leak campaign?

The answer, because Libby obstructed justice and threw sand in the eyes of the DOJ preventing them from investigating this crime.

Libby is the only person who can give the testimony necessary to conclude the investigation and begin the prosecution. He was there, in Cheney's office. Libby refuses to provide this testimony, instead he committed multiple perjury and obstructed justice. Bush pardoned Libby. Taking away the DOJ's only possible means of coercing truthful testimony out of Libby. Therefore, the Bush Administration can not and will not be brought to justice for its admitted outing of a CIA agent (which is technically treason).

Conclusion: Bush pardoned Libby to give his own administration immunity from prosecuton for the treasonous act of outing a CIA agent.

Isn't that a little different than Clinton pardoning his drunken schlub of a brother for doing drugs, a decade after that brother served his full sentence?

[Golmacmourna]

It's always ugly when spin undermines someone who's doing something valid; using any outlet available to inform people of something fundamentally *wrong*.

She's not a political icon. She can't get people to call a press conference just to listen to her explain her side of the story, or play a tv spot attacking the conduct that compramised her career. The media available to a private citizen are books, and TV shows that have guests.

[Noleader]

QFT. Seriously, you must have had the sound turned off completely.

Plame has said a number of times she was proud of the service she and her contacts provided to our nation and very sad that she no longer gets to do what she loved.

What Bush did was unacceptable and should be punished to the full extent of the law. He did nothing short of Treason for those that are mistaken in their preception of what happened.